tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-417475152705096483.post8421724691905386273..comments2023-06-04T03:08:10.609-04:00Comments on Salty Current: Atheist inclusion in official memorials: some issuesSChttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01328512370690763252noreply@blogger.comBlogger3125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-417475152705096483.post-22905133507398300822013-04-22T18:37:38.942-04:002013-04-22T18:37:38.942-04:00I think it's doubtful that we'll come to a...I think it's doubtful that we'll come to agree on the central point, but I would like to voice support for your criticisms of the wording of the call for responses. It does sound unnecessarily like we are more interested in group representatives' views, when in fact I'm sure Dave is interested in hearing from everyone who has a stake in this question, whatever their position.<br /><br />On the issue of inclusion, we at HCH were put in a very difficult position at very short notice: the state organized an official response to the attacks, and decided to make it an interfaith service. In my view that was an inappropriate decision, and I certainly agree that a secular response would have been more appropriate. I agree, too, that we could certainly host our own secular response - which we did yesterday and which was a very moving event for all involved. <br /><br />However, at the same time, we felt t would be appropriate for Humanists and the nonreligious to have some representation at the official civic response to the attacks, which is why we pressed for inclusion. The idea of the service was certainly for it to be inclusive: it was billed as such by the governor's office. And so there is a tension between that expressed desire and the decision to host an interfaith service. <br /><br />I don't think there is an easy way to resolve all the tensions here, but I think a Humanist voice would have been welcomed by many at the service and in the wider community, who were looking for someone to say what they were feeling. To me, to accept exclusion by default would be to fail to stand up for the importance of Humanist values at a time when representing and promoting them is especially critical, which is something I am not willing to do.<br /><br />This may be a case in which values genuinely clash, and each person has to decide for themselves how to prioritize values. I just hope you can understand that we have a community of Humanists who were harmed in these attacks and who wanted to be represented in the official governmental response to those attacks. As a member of that community I'm happy that the person who represents us pushed for that inclusion.James Crofthttp://templeofthefuture.netnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-417475152705096483.post-35696959742643056902013-04-21T20:37:49.851-04:002013-04-21T20:37:49.851-04:00As I posted on Ophelia's blog, I read Muscato&...As I posted on Ophelia's blog, I read Muscato's request as addressed to the leadership of atheist, secular and humanist organizations. His last paragraph<br /><br /><i>Greg Epstein from the Humanist Community at Harvard is meeting with public officials to discuss this issue and would like to pass on responses from our community’s leaders. We also encourage you to solicit responses from members of your communities (if you run a blog, your readers; if you have a TV show, your viewers, etc) that he can include as well.</i><br /><br />definitely gives the impression that the leaders' comments are what's important and the hoi polloi's responses might be useful to bulk out the sheaf of paper the public officials can ignore.Michaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15375973697938997176noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-417475152705096483.post-48703070748405893682013-04-21T11:52:26.779-04:002013-04-21T11:52:26.779-04:00Thanks. That helped me clarify my uneasiness with ...Thanks. That helped me clarify my uneasiness with 'interfaith' (other than the obvious fact that it normally only includes the xian faiths).<br /><br />I wonder if some of the 'deep rifts' in the atheist community are because atheism is a 'faith' position for some people -- mostly a faith that they are members of the smart kids club it would appear. Seeing atheism as a 'faith' would also explain some of the weirdness with the Harvard 'chaplain' and some others. That is very different than not having faith, i.e., believing things only on the basis of reason and evidence rather than faith.Margaretnoreply@blogger.com